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 Confused...Arabian saddles
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/20/2006 :  06:49:43 AM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
I will remeasure the skirt but I believe it is that short. I try to put it high on her withers and pull it back until it rest naturally on her back that that is what I came up with where it seems to fall into place. If I get a more narrow gullet I would think that the bars wouldn't be wide enough, to me her saddle looks like it isn't wide enough and pops up on the back especially when it is cinched down. If I remember correctly the template with the narrow gullet didn't lay exactly flat it kind of jetted out but maybe I should take some pictures of the two and post them.
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Stormie
Clinician

1630 Posts

Posted - 02/21/2006 :  12:53:43 AM  Show Profile  Visit Stormie's Homepage Send Stormie a Private Message
Breeze

If the saddle is too narrow in the front it will sit up high in the front. If it is too wide it will sit low popping the back up. So chances are it is too wide in the front.

Saddles are all balanced different. Doing the pulling it back to find the natrual place on the back is fine BUT if the saddle doesn't fit in the first place it isn't going to sit in the right spot on it's own. A saddle that is too wide might want to slide too far back, one that is narrow might not want to slide back far enough.

The narrow template juts out on the bottom? That sounds like it is too flat of an angle. A saddle that is too wide should sit lower and only touch the top edge of the bars. One that is too narrow should sit high and only touch on the bottom edge. Of course that is major differences, a slight difference you might not see as easy.

In the photo of the close up of the withers that saddle is really low over the withers. Even with a pad it has a good chance of sitting on them when you are in the saddle.

Measure the skirt but also measure her back to see how long she is.
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/21/2006 :  09:48:01 AM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
OK, so when I first measured with the templates I measured about a 6 3/4 gullet but I think she needs wide bars, but short because of her back. When I used the templates to measure her current saddle if I measured in the right place, but who knows, I got a 7" gullet but Chuck suggested that go with the 7" because it would be hard to find a wider saddle with a 6 3/4" gullet but looking at "Arabian" saddles I noted that a lot mention that their gullets were 6 1/2 to 6 3/4 with Arab bars. So I should probably go with a smaller gullet size and find one that has a short skirt but for the wideth I think I am going to have a problem.

Thank you for all of your advice and help, it really does help me sort things out.
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Stormie
Clinician

1630 Posts

Posted - 02/22/2006 :  12:01:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit Stormie's Homepage Send Stormie a Private Message
Now I'm confused. When I say that I think she doesn't need wide I'm talking wide angle as in Full QH bars not in Gullet width. If you are using the normal/narrow templates and measure her for needing a 7" that would be a Semi with a 7" not a Wide tree with a 7" does that make sense? If she is measure for a normal/narrow with 7" and you get a full with 7" that the angle is going to be all wrong and not fit.
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/25/2006 :  7:26:13 PM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
OK I tried her saddle on again and I agree that the gullet is to wide when I really looked at it I could get about 2 1/2 fingers in there without it cinched. I bought an Smartcinch today by the way, I like it. When we cinch it down it does pop up in the back. I went to the local tack store which is very small. The only lady there could not tell me exactly where to measure the gullet width but she said most she had was semi-quarter horse bars, with a 7" gullet. I brought my measuring tape and I measured a lot of them. They measured 7". I measured mine at home again about the same place I measured the others and got a 7" gullet width. I can't find a stamp on mine anywhere to tell me who made it so I cant find out what exactly it is. So I think the one I have now is a 7" gullet with normal/narrow bars so now I know I don't need that and I need a smaller gullet the next step is finding one with a smaller gullet and a round skirt.
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  05:50:39 AM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
7 inch wide gullet is a wide saddle. I think it would be unusual for a tack shop to have a large selection of 7" gullet saddles. I would have to think that perhaps you are not measuring in the right place.

Your saddle did appear too wide in the picture. Perhaps you could post a picture showing the tape in position at the front of the saddle so we could help.
When using Chuck's template it should be placed about 1.5 inches back of the shoulder bone on the horses withers which is where the narrowest part of the tree shuld fit. If you take the other part of Chucks cut-out and hold it up to the saddle tree you should be able to see how the saddle will fit in the area within the gullet that matches with the same position on the horse withers. Hope this helps.

If you need more help perhaps I could put the templates on Hook and then within his barrel saddle if necessary. I have used the templates on Hook who is 16.2 hands with a real muscular build and the template show him to need a 7" wide, narrow angle tree and his TexFlex barrel saddle is 6.5" narrow angle. Chuck had only one reccomended barrel saddle of this configuration, 7" wide -narrow angle. I still have to get a new saddle for Hook but am presently getting by with a thinner saddle blanket.

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  10:48:14 AM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
Here is a picture of where I am measuring. I also thought it was weird that she said most of the saddles were 7" gullet but semi quarter horse bars but when I measured I got 7" also so I must be measuring at the wrong point.



I am not exactly sure what you mean when you said about taking part of the template and measuring her and taking the other half and measuring the saddle but I will get my husband to read it and see if he can figure it out.

I really appreciate all of your help because I don't have anyone to help me with this and the tack shop wasn't to helpful but I just think that the lady wasn't sure about measuring saddles herself.
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  12:33:15 PM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
OK here are the pictures that I have. I took the 6 1/2" gullet with the wide angel and the narrow/normal angle. My husband seems to think that the wide angle is to wide because when he held his side there was a small gap at the end corner plus it looks like it sits lower on her withers but I would love to hear your opinion.

Wide angle


Wide angle


Wide angle


Wide angle



Narrow Angle
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e159/Gypzywingz/61-2narrowangle4.jpg

Narrow Angle


Narrow Angle


Narrow Angle



See my pictures at Photobucket
http://photobucket.com/albums/e159/Gypzywingz/
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Chuck
Forum Admin



USA
1265 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  12:45:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit Chuck's Homepage Send Chuck a Private Message
Yes, the wide is too wide. You need the narrow angle. Also, your method of measuring the gullet is a bit off. You would measure the span that actually has contact with the horse rather than the outside. Your saddle appears to have 6" or 6.25" finished gullet width. That is the measurement measured between the conchos. You would measure under the saddle rather than the outside of the saddle.

Chuck

Horse Saddle Shop

http://www.horsesaddleshop.com
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  1:45:21 PM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
Wow chuck so that means that the saddle I have now is about a 6.25 to 6.5 narrow angle I guess, it is really hard to get the measuring tape in there to tell. So what saddles do suggest? The semi-quarter horse bars with a 6" gullet?
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2006 :  2:03:05 PM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
OK I took the inside of the templates and matched them together, I think that is what Hook might of been talking about and I think the 6" one seemed to fit in there the best. I think I may be in trouble trying to find a saddle with a smaller gullet than that since the next size you have in your narrow templates is 5.25"
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 02/27/2006 :  05:46:26 AM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by BreezedBayou

OK I took the inside of the templates and matched them together, I think that is what Hook might of been talking about and I think the 6" one seemed to fit in there the best. I think I may be in trouble trying to find a saddle with a smaller gullet than that since the next size you have in your narrow templates is 5.25"



I think you are on the right track here. The 6.5 narrow angle looks like a pretty good fit. Chuck can advise you better but it makes sense to me that the saddle inside should match the inside cut-out at the part that touches the horses withers.

Also keep in mind that the profile of the saddle from front to back where the tree sits on the horse also is a factor fitting a saddle.
The use of a flextree saddle can help here.

I would think the Chuck would have a saddle with a tree designed for Arabs that would meet your needs.

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/27/2006 :  07:42:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
Yeah I was thinking about the flex tree as well because there are some Arabian saddles out there that are 6 1/4 gullet with Arabian bars but I think that the width would be a problem because I think most saddle makers assume that all Arabians are very round in the barrel from what I can find. So I guess I need to see if I can find a saddle that has a 6" gullet I guess with a narrow/normal tree but with a short round skirt and short bars, oh this is going to be real fun, lol. Of course there are no saddle shops around where I can try saddles on. I am still not real sure about the gullet size only because the saddle she has now the gullet is to big and it pops up in the back when cinched but according to measurements and Chuck I believe my saddle must be about 6 1/4 gullet or so so I can only think I need a 6" gullet.
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 02/28/2006 :  05:57:42 AM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
Sound like you are on the right track. You know a lot mare about saddle sizes now and I am sure you will find the right one. I suspect an Arabian sadlle is where you will end up.
Good Luck

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/28/2006 :  06:28:05 AM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
I thought about that too hook but the Arabian saddles have a wider tree, I believe the widest of them all so that wouldn't work for her.
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 02/28/2006 :  5:32:52 PM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
Most Arabians are narrower thorugh the withers than a Quarter horse and I am surpized that you think Arab aaddles are wider.

Take the cut-outs to the tack shop and check them out to make sure.

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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BreezedBayou
Beginning Rider



USA
67 Posts

Posted - 02/28/2006 :  9:07:58 PM  Show Profile  Visit BreezedBayou's Homepage Send BreezedBayou a Private Message
I read tha the Arab bars are wider that is why I am so confused about all of this. I did a wither tracing tonight using heavy duty gage wire and traced it on large paper and the gullet size is definately smaller than my saddle so you were right about the gullet being to big but by Chucks guess my saddles gullet is already about 6.25. I can't find anything in a western that is 6", 16" seat and with I guess normal bars but short.

Also when I did the wire I found out that her left side is wider than her right :)
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