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Saddletramp
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
2546 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2005 :  10:17:51 PM  Show Profile  Visit Saddletramp's Homepage Send Saddletramp a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by alidansma

Yes Hook, she is just a plain old Quarter horse.




Hey, we quarter horse people have the numbers on our side! Largest horse registry, yada, yada! So there ain't nothin' plain about her! She's in good company! hehehe

Love the bays!! Thanks for sharing, and welcome, alidansma!

-Saddletramp

"She never moved the stars from their courses,
but she loved a good man and she rode good horses"
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alidansma
Tenderfoot

7 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2005 :  09:30:13 AM  Show Profile  Visit alidansma's Homepage Send alidansma a Private Message
Thank you all for the information. I feel like I am doing alright now.
Fractured bones - yes the Pomona one. I went a couple of years ago - when I had no horse and I loved it - it will be so much better this year getting all the free stuff from *my* horse ;)
Thank you also for the website. That is what I am looking for Budget quality horse necessities..Thanks again!
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alidansma
Tenderfoot

7 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2005 :  09:30:13 AM  Show Profile  Visit alidansma's Homepage Send alidansma a Private Message
Thank you all for the information. I feel like I am doing alright now.
Fractured bones - yes the Pomona one. I went a couple of years ago - when I had no horse and I loved it - it will be so much better this year getting all the free stuff from *my* horse ;)
Thank you also for the website. That is what I am looking for Budget quality horse necessities..Thanks again!
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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2005 :  12:42:47 PM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Welcome. When you have your own horse, think thirst for knowledge is far greater. The clinics/equine affairs so helpful. Plus all the goodies to look at whether you need the stuff or not!
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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2005 :  12:42:47 PM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Welcome. When you have your own horse, think thirst for knowledge is far greater. The clinics/equine affairs so helpful. Plus all the goodies to look at whether you need the stuff or not!
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2005 :  11:55:39 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
Alidansma, welcome from another newbie horse owner also! You will get GREAT advice here, and everyone couldn't possibly be more helpful... and NICE!!
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2005 :  11:55:39 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
Alidansma, welcome from another newbie horse owner also! You will get GREAT advice here, and everyone couldn't possibly be more helpful... and NICE!!
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Frost
Beginning Rider



USA
115 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2005 :  6:45:13 PM  Show Profile  Visit Frost's Homepage Send Frost a Private Message
Welcom!! Sammy and I "clicker" train Promise..sort of.. we don't have a clicker and thought it might be inconveninet, so we make sort of a "cluck cluck" sound with our tongue going from the roof of our mouth down. Makes a quite distinct sound, and THATS what it takes. We reward her for doing good and never give her a treat before we "ASK" her to do smoething and she performs well and we never give her a treat unless we "Cluck-cluck" first. eg. She comes up to us and I tell her BACK ... BACK.. motioning with my fingers and hand, and she backs up well.. no halter etc.. so I not only say good girl but if I have a small treat she gets it AFTER I cluck-cluck.

Horses will test daily for respect. Don't be offenede by it and never let emmotions come into play (anger fear...they lead to the Dark side! ) But do move the horse and controlling the feet re-establishes your respect. Licking lips is a good indication of acceptance.. (no...don't lick her lips. she will lick her own ) Ho Ho Ho.. pleas pass the eggnog!!

Also there is a difference between pinning the ears back and laying the ears back. Pinning is a definite offensive stance where as laying the ears back may be for listening behind a bit better or just some measure of discomfort.. but Pinning is really a look all it's own.
Cheers!!

Vern

Former Nebraskan...
"The quickest way to double your money is to fold it over and put it back in your pocket."

'May the HORSE be with you!' Gentle as possible, yet firm as necessary.
"I like to ride bareback, and sometimes I even wear a shirt!"
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Frost
Beginning Rider



USA
115 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2005 :  6:45:13 PM  Show Profile  Visit Frost's Homepage Send Frost a Private Message
Welcom!! Sammy and I "clicker" train Promise..sort of.. we don't have a clicker and thought it might be inconveninet, so we make sort of a "cluck cluck" sound with our tongue going from the roof of our mouth down. Makes a quite distinct sound, and THATS what it takes. We reward her for doing good and never give her a treat before we "ASK" her to do smoething and she performs well and we never give her a treat unless we "Cluck-cluck" first. eg. She comes up to us and I tell her BACK ... BACK.. motioning with my fingers and hand, and she backs up well.. no halter etc.. so I not only say good girl but if I have a small treat she gets it AFTER I cluck-cluck.

Horses will test daily for respect. Don't be offenede by it and never let emmotions come into play (anger fear...they lead to the Dark side! ) But do move the horse and controlling the feet re-establishes your respect. Licking lips is a good indication of acceptance.. (no...don't lick her lips. she will lick her own ) Ho Ho Ho.. pleas pass the eggnog!!

Also there is a difference between pinning the ears back and laying the ears back. Pinning is a definite offensive stance where as laying the ears back may be for listening behind a bit better or just some measure of discomfort.. but Pinning is really a look all it's own.
Cheers!!

Vern

Former Nebraskan...
"The quickest way to double your money is to fold it over and put it back in your pocket."

'May the HORSE be with you!' Gentle as possible, yet firm as necessary.
"I like to ride bareback, and sometimes I even wear a shirt!"
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2005 :  9:57:00 PM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
Yes, as Frost has said there is a distinct difference between the flat, laid-back ears of an angry horse and the cocked-back ear of a horse that's listening to what you are trying to tell him when mounted. When a horse is angry, the ears will practically disappear, they will be so flat against his head & neck. His whole expression will be one of frustration. When a horse is listening, the ears won't be near this flat and usually don't touch the head or neck at all.

When riding or doing ground work, I want to see that ear cocked toward me no matter where I am at the time. It means my horse is focusing on me... either ready to do what I want or trying to understand what I am trying to teach him to do. When you are working with a horse and he has his ears perked forward and looking anywhere but at you, he has totally tuned you out and not paying you the least bit of attention. Sort of like a child daydreaming in class at school instead of listening to the teacher or has been distracted by a noise outside. That's when I'll bring my horse's focus back on me by use of a gentle cue or the sound of my voice.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2005 :  9:57:00 PM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
Yes, as Frost has said there is a distinct difference between the flat, laid-back ears of an angry horse and the cocked-back ear of a horse that's listening to what you are trying to tell him when mounted. When a horse is angry, the ears will practically disappear, they will be so flat against his head & neck. His whole expression will be one of frustration. When a horse is listening, the ears won't be near this flat and usually don't touch the head or neck at all.

When riding or doing ground work, I want to see that ear cocked toward me no matter where I am at the time. It means my horse is focusing on me... either ready to do what I want or trying to understand what I am trying to teach him to do. When you are working with a horse and he has his ears perked forward and looking anywhere but at you, he has totally tuned you out and not paying you the least bit of attention. Sort of like a child daydreaming in class at school instead of listening to the teacher or has been distracted by a noise outside. That's when I'll bring my horse's focus back on me by use of a gentle cue or the sound of my voice.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  06:26:43 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
RH, what about not 100% of either? If I'm on the ground, Cloud is in her pen unhaltered, and she's annoyed, her ears aren't pinned flat, but definitely back, and I'm not on her back so it's sure not listening. When you see that, do you do any grumbling based on ears meaning "atitude" or do you have to wait until she does something more overt?
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  06:26:43 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
RH, what about not 100% of either? If I'm on the ground, Cloud is in her pen unhaltered, and she's annoyed, her ears aren't pinned flat, but definitely back, and I'm not on her back so it's sure not listening. When you see that, do you do any grumbling based on ears meaning "atitude" or do you have to wait until she does something more overt?
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  06:45:32 AM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
I think that the respectful ear position is towards you. Anything else is at worst case not paying attention to you. Treat this as a lack of respect and re-focus her attention on you. The tighter the ears are to the neck the more agressive the horse's attitude. A boss mare uses the "look - tight back ears and bared teeth" to assert dominance even from the other side of the arena. Dreams - our boss mare - looks at Sugar ( near the bottom of the totem pole) across the arean. If Dreams doesn't get acknowledgement from Sugar she will approach Sugar with the ears back until the acknowledgement. Sometimes she has to follow up but most times the look is sufficient. If you feel uncomfortable with the ear position make sure she know that you "DON'T LIKE IT" and she will learn quickly how to please you to get her feed.

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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Hook
Trail Boss (Moderator)



Canada
6115 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  06:45:32 AM  Show Profile  Visit Hook's Homepage Send Hook a Private Message
I think that the respectful ear position is towards you. Anything else is at worst case not paying attention to you. Treat this as a lack of respect and re-focus her attention on you. The tighter the ears are to the neck the more agressive the horse's attitude. A boss mare uses the "look - tight back ears and bared teeth" to assert dominance even from the other side of the arena. Dreams - our boss mare - looks at Sugar ( near the bottom of the totem pole) across the arean. If Dreams doesn't get acknowledgement from Sugar she will approach Sugar with the ears back until the acknowledgement. Sometimes she has to follow up but most times the look is sufficient. If you feel uncomfortable with the ear position make sure she know that you "DON'T LIKE IT" and she will learn quickly how to please you to get her feed.

Hook(ed)......on Horses

"The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life. " Author: Robert Louis Stevenson
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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  10:51:29 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Takes time to learn body language. Best way is to watch your horse with others. My TB is a moody mare, will turn her head and give me "the look" sometimes when grooming. Give it back or ask her if she feels lucky...usually does the trick.

Someone mentioned horses will challenge your leadership off and on....I find this to be very true esp. with the TB and fjord. Like kids, they need reminders of who is in charge and will test you. Sometimes all it takes (whether ears back or pushing on you) is a little redirection...backing them a step or two, moving their hindquarters or even a "hey!" gets them thinking, back in line often. They know they've been called on it and not a huge battle with each event long as you keep on their butts with the behaviors.

Lately I've been carrying a dressage whip when I lead the fjord down to the arena . He's been friskier/pushier with the cooler weather and my foot/ankle gets torqued with one small mis-step lately. Much better behaved. No whacking, he just knows it's the arm extension to tap, point and make him move when needed.
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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  10:51:29 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Takes time to learn body language. Best way is to watch your horse with others. My TB is a moody mare, will turn her head and give me "the look" sometimes when grooming. Give it back or ask her if she feels lucky...usually does the trick.

Someone mentioned horses will challenge your leadership off and on....I find this to be very true esp. with the TB and fjord. Like kids, they need reminders of who is in charge and will test you. Sometimes all it takes (whether ears back or pushing on you) is a little redirection...backing them a step or two, moving their hindquarters or even a "hey!" gets them thinking, back in line often. They know they've been called on it and not a huge battle with each event long as you keep on their butts with the behaviors.

Lately I've been carrying a dressage whip when I lead the fjord down to the arena . He's been friskier/pushier with the cooler weather and my foot/ankle gets torqued with one small mis-step lately. Much better behaved. No whacking, he just knows it's the arm extension to tap, point and make him move when needed.
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  1:06:12 PM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
Thanks for answering for me Hook & Bones . Both of you are right on.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  1:06:12 PM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
Thanks for answering for me Hook & Bones . Both of you are right on.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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Frost
Beginning Rider



USA
115 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  7:36:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit Frost's Homepage Send Frost a Private Message
I've got a walking stick I use to go to the hay shed. It's acually a rake handle that broke right at the rake.. or it is a hoe.. some flavor like that. It is not for hitting and abusing it is an extension of me.. a safe extension. And, I can poke with it and get a message across quite well. We are 150 to 235 lb people. Horses are 900 to 1300 lbs some more.. some less. Kicking one another and biting is normal in the herd and few suffer major injuries from that. You don't want to haul off and start smacking a horse with a stick, but it's a good 'defensive' tool. Those handy sticks and carrot sticks work very well too. It's just I have the plain old handle that sticks in the snow and I grab it when I move about. Promise followed along behind me the other day and came up on the side and then blocked me right in the path by standing broadside to me. I poked her with the stick, she kicked a bit, and then I raised the stick and chased her a few steps. Got up to the hay she came up we exchanged mutual greeting of peace and all was over. Correction needs to be without anger, without malice and imminenet "make up" on terms of good will.

Vern

Former Nebraskan...
"The quickest way to double your money is to fold it over and put it back in your pocket."

'May the HORSE be with you!' Gentle as possible, yet firm as necessary.
"I like to ride bareback, and sometimes I even wear a shirt!"
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Frost
Beginning Rider



USA
115 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  7:36:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit Frost's Homepage Send Frost a Private Message
I've got a walking stick I use to go to the hay shed. It's acually a rake handle that broke right at the rake.. or it is a hoe.. some flavor like that. It is not for hitting and abusing it is an extension of me.. a safe extension. And, I can poke with it and get a message across quite well. We are 150 to 235 lb people. Horses are 900 to 1300 lbs some more.. some less. Kicking one another and biting is normal in the herd and few suffer major injuries from that. You don't want to haul off and start smacking a horse with a stick, but it's a good 'defensive' tool. Those handy sticks and carrot sticks work very well too. It's just I have the plain old handle that sticks in the snow and I grab it when I move about. Promise followed along behind me the other day and came up on the side and then blocked me right in the path by standing broadside to me. I poked her with the stick, she kicked a bit, and then I raised the stick and chased her a few steps. Got up to the hay she came up we exchanged mutual greeting of peace and all was over. Correction needs to be without anger, without malice and imminenet "make up" on terms of good will.

Vern

Former Nebraskan...
"The quickest way to double your money is to fold it over and put it back in your pocket."

'May the HORSE be with you!' Gentle as possible, yet firm as necessary.
"I like to ride bareback, and sometimes I even wear a shirt!"
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alidansma
Tenderfoot

7 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  11:26:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit alidansma's Homepage Send alidansma a Private Message
The ears on my mare aren't flat back, but they are definatly cranky looking. as I said before she is the only horse here, at her old home she was bossy with the other horses, so maybe she is used to being at the top of the pecking order.
Also now that it has been brought up, I was wondering about the licking chewing and snapping. I have noticed her putting her ears back and air snapping when I am grooming sometimes, I am guessing I have just hit an uncomfortable spot.
Sometimes when moving her around I will get the head drop and chewing/lip licking behavior - which I thought meant that she was thinking about what was going on, trying to figure out if she was doing the right thing.
Now the other behavior I don't know if it should be interpreted as a threat or affection or what: non-agressive licking or mouthing. Like when she lips the edge of my shirt or licks my open palm. I am guessing that that is just curiosity, but I am wondering if I should discourage it and if this behavior has any signifigance.

Also I took her out again for a walk the other day and it seems that she just really needs to move around more - I can't wait until I have an arena to work her in. Thanks for all of the information so far.

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alidansma
Tenderfoot

7 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2005 :  11:26:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit alidansma's Homepage Send alidansma a Private Message
The ears on my mare aren't flat back, but they are definatly cranky looking. as I said before she is the only horse here, at her old home she was bossy with the other horses, so maybe she is used to being at the top of the pecking order.
Also now that it has been brought up, I was wondering about the licking chewing and snapping. I have noticed her putting her ears back and air snapping when I am grooming sometimes, I am guessing I have just hit an uncomfortable spot.
Sometimes when moving her around I will get the head drop and chewing/lip licking behavior - which I thought meant that she was thinking about what was going on, trying to figure out if she was doing the right thing.
Now the other behavior I don't know if it should be interpreted as a threat or affection or what: non-agressive licking or mouthing. Like when she lips the edge of my shirt or licks my open palm. I am guessing that that is just curiosity, but I am wondering if I should discourage it and if this behavior has any signifigance.

Also I took her out again for a walk the other day and it seems that she just really needs to move around more - I can't wait until I have an arena to work her in. Thanks for all of the information so far.

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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2005 :  10:07:15 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Lipping your shirt or anything on your person, in my book she is invading your space and would reprimand. You never know when a lip can turn into a bite. Same thing with air biting... consider that a precursor to the real thing and do a verbal, hairy eyeball or reposition, or all three. My TB does same things, has a few tender spots and try to go gentle on them. If licking your palm, figure you must be offering it to the horse..just watch the fingers.

Oonce I invited the fjord in for a head nuzzle...the little bugger untied my sweats in a flash! Shiney bead on tie caught his attention! Good to teach them their space, esp. if kids around, keep them from sniffing/nibbling the farrier's cap/butt, etc!








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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2005 :  10:07:15 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Lipping your shirt or anything on your person, in my book she is invading your space and would reprimand. You never know when a lip can turn into a bite. Same thing with air biting... consider that a precursor to the real thing and do a verbal, hairy eyeball or reposition, or all three. My TB does same things, has a few tender spots and try to go gentle on them. If licking your palm, figure you must be offering it to the horse..just watch the fingers.

Oonce I invited the fjord in for a head nuzzle...the little bugger untied my sweats in a flash! Shiney bead on tie caught his attention! Good to teach them their space, esp. if kids around, keep them from sniffing/nibbling the farrier's cap/butt, etc!








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