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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  08:06:46 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
After a reasonable bit of research, I decided to try the Woody Pet pellets. I did a total strip-out of indoor pen and spread out the prescribed amount of pellets. (A SPARCE layer!!) They are said to need moisture to break down (e.g., urine that, for a period of time only) you mix in). I think the rainy weather and consequent moisture in the air alone has worked its magic on them because (a) it's gone from the initial sparce 1-inch thick layer to about 3 inches of finer material and it's not entirely broken down yet; and (b) it's turning into a finer, extremely easily manageable, light colored bedding.

So far, at least (just a few days), I am LOVING this stuff!!! Even little pieces of "apples" are easy to spot, and all the WP shakes out of the fork so there is NO waste of bedding. I understand that once all the pellets break down into the finer material, then the breakdown procecss is complete, and you isolate and remove the WP that shows urine spots. And you replace whatever you've taken out with 1/3rd the volume of pellets because it will, in turn, break down and "volume-ize."

From everything I can see, this is by far a superior material to shavings. You can see stuff easier. You can remove it easier. You're not carting away tons of shavings, it's much more efficient.

And though it LQQKED expensive to start with, it's definitely appearing that in the long run there is going to be a whole lot less $$ outlay to keep it fresh and right. With good management (conscientious cleaning) they claim that a total stall strip-out is needed only every 2-5 months. From what I've seen just this far, I can definitely see how that could be the case.

I think this is going to end up being a whole lot less work, a substantially smaller manure pile, and I do believe a significant amount less costly. Also a lot easier to store, because the stuff is concentrated in the bag. (Our shavings come wrapped in brown paper so they must be stored inside and protected. The WP comes in waterproof, tough plastic bagging and can actually be stored outside in the elements if necessary.)

Am I sounding like a commercial?? LOL! Well, as a newbie horse owner who's doing everything myself with no help, I'm definitely going to be getting excited over discoveries that work!

I'll keep reporting progress of WP's effectiveness as time goes on, because I'm following their recommended management to a "T" and I know I'm not the only one who's been struggling with heaps 'o bedding that just doesn't show bad spots easily enough to feel confident that I'm keeping my horse's area CLEAN.

Saddletramp
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
2546 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  08:22:03 AM  Show Profile  Visit Saddletramp's Homepage Send Saddletramp a Private Message
I'm glad that you are having such a good experience so far with the WP!

I'm doing the math, tho.
Cost-wise, I don't know what area you are in....but the low price of my shavings will set my standard....I can get a 6-month supply of shavings for $120. So $240 a year would ony buy me 48 bags of WP (at a cost of $5 per bag in my area). That is less than one bag per week, in ONE stall, not including the start-up bags, or strip-out and re-bed. I can't justify the extra expense in my case.

I do agree, it WAS very easy to clean, and had much less waste.

Let us know if you continue to be pleased with it. I'm interested in ammonia build-up, and does anyone else have to sift thru the WHOLE stall?

-Saddletramp

"She never moved the stars from their courses,
but she loved a good man and she rode good horses"
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Saddletramp
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
2546 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  08:22:03 AM  Show Profile  Visit Saddletramp's Homepage Send Saddletramp a Private Message
I'm glad that you are having such a good experience so far with the WP!

I'm doing the math, tho.
Cost-wise, I don't know what area you are in....but the low price of my shavings will set my standard....I can get a 6-month supply of shavings for $120. So $240 a year would ony buy me 48 bags of WP (at a cost of $5 per bag in my area). That is less than one bag per week, in ONE stall, not including the start-up bags, or strip-out and re-bed. I can't justify the extra expense in my case.

I do agree, it WAS very easy to clean, and had much less waste.

Let us know if you continue to be pleased with it. I'm interested in ammonia build-up, and does anyone else have to sift thru the WHOLE stall?

-Saddletramp

"She never moved the stars from their courses,
but she loved a good man and she rode good horses"
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PaintGal
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
5300 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  08:48:26 AM  Show Profile Send PaintGal a Private Message
I've used both shavings & Woody Pet & agree that WP is less expensive & easier to use than shavings. It is initially more expensive but if you follow the directions and mix the wet & dry areas, it lasts a long long time.

Saddle, how would you feel about an experiment? Set up one stall with Woody Pet & compare cost/ease of use/lifespan of WP and report back...or have you already done that? It would be expensive to jump in & use in a bunch of stalls all at once but I think you can order skids of the stuff for less/bag than what you can buy single bags at TSC.

Karen ~ Trails
&
Joe Paint Gelding
Paoli, IN


"My treasures do not sparkle or glitter, they shine in the sun and neigh in the night."



~~~~~~
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PaintGal
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
5300 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  08:48:26 AM  Show Profile Send PaintGal a Private Message
I've used both shavings & Woody Pet & agree that WP is less expensive & easier to use than shavings. It is initially more expensive but if you follow the directions and mix the wet & dry areas, it lasts a long long time.

Saddle, how would you feel about an experiment? Set up one stall with Woody Pet & compare cost/ease of use/lifespan of WP and report back...or have you already done that? It would be expensive to jump in & use in a bunch of stalls all at once but I think you can order skids of the stuff for less/bag than what you can buy single bags at TSC.

Karen ~ Trails
&
Joe Paint Gelding
Paoli, IN


"My treasures do not sparkle or glitter, they shine in the sun and neigh in the night."



~~~~~~
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  09:39:58 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
Saddle, that would be an interesting experiment that Karen suggests -- one stall with WP and the rest as you've been.

In my area, shavings are $3.90/bag if you buy 10+ at a time, otherwise $4.25/bag. (Huge bag and I don't recall the cu. ft. each bag). Woody Pet is $5.19/bag. I'm using her indoor pen as my experiment, and did not put the WP as far as her door, but about a 12 x 12 area only. Normally that would take me 4-5 bags of shavings for a nice layer. That's (rounding off) 4-5 x $4 or $16-$20 to start out.

My problem is that within a week, those shavings are trampled, darkened, and it's impossible to see pee spots. Also very hard to see apples or pieces thereof if she breaks them up (which she can do fairly immediately before I get to it -- I clean her stall 2x/day.

Okay, I used 7 bags to start with of WP. That's (rounding off) $36 or so. HOWEVER, they are expanding to make a nice thick layer of finer stuff so that you can see wet spots and even broken up apples, and get them out without dragging shavings along (or alternatively spending a long time shaking them through the tines).

So it's most definitely more expensive starting out. They say it will be. But here's where the savings is claimed to come in: To start with, yes, you DO mix in the wet spots with the dry stuff, as they are used to expand the WP. However, once it's broken down (expanded) --and here's where a lot of people go wrong-- you STOP mixing in wet spots. You now want to remove them. However, instead of spreading out as they do with shavings (and taking a lot of unfouled or gratuitously fouled ADJACENT shavings along with them as a result of the spreading), the wet spots stay put. They are very easily identifiable. So you are removing JUST that part.

And now, when you are replenishing them (call it "Stage Two") as in "maintenance," you are adding substantially less additional WP, and you are mixing it in with the broken down material so that it will, as a result, also break down.

I have no clue how this will pan out over time, but I can tell you that so far (and it's only been about 4 days) the WP is processing beautifully. That means its original volume is expanding into a super nice consistency of bedding, and its volume has increased into a nice thick layer. And that layer, by its nature, is very easy to keep clean. A WHOLE lot cleaner than my shavings would have been in this same period of time.

Though it's not the same as there isn't the "cement" added, I'm equating it, in practice, to the difference between using "clumpable" cat litter vs. non-clump. With the Clump type, the cat piddles in a spot and that spot clumps together so you can easily remove it. What's left around the clumps you've removed is untouched, pristine cat litter.

In practice, the WP seems to operate similarly. When I replace some, I will NOT be adding volume-for-volume of new WP to what's been taken out, but instead, only 1/3rd the volume. So the smaller bags, and the "concentrated" material, even things out. The difference (important in my case) is that I'm not hauling big, bulky, heavy bags of shavings; but instead, "scoops"
of replenishing WP.

I did not understand at first how this stuff works (or is meant to work). But basically, there's a magical point where you go FROM mixing in to removal, and if you really read their instructions and follow them, you'll end up with MUCH less work, a much cleaner stall, easier maintenace and no urine smell. Again, the problems I've read people having have seemed to have arisen because they don't know when to stop mixing in the original "moisture." That's fine at first (and recommended) because that helps it expand, and it gets absorbed so there's no odor. But once you've done that initial step, you don't KEEP mixing in the urine spots, you quit.

I probably could have said all this in less words, but I'm learning as I go and for once I'm trusting in the packaged directions and going on blind faith that it works the way they say. Assuming it does, I'm definitely a convert. Clinton Anderson did a big demonstration on one of his segments (not WP but another brand that operates on the same premise) and he said right then and there that the company now sponsors him. HOWEVER, he said that he used the product for two years before that came about, and swore by it.

So we'll see. So far, I'm VERY impressed!!! It just stays cleaner and makes "things" very easy to identify. At least with my eyesight, lol. Actually it's pretty good. Duhhhh, I think.

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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  09:39:58 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
Saddle, that would be an interesting experiment that Karen suggests -- one stall with WP and the rest as you've been.

In my area, shavings are $3.90/bag if you buy 10+ at a time, otherwise $4.25/bag. (Huge bag and I don't recall the cu. ft. each bag). Woody Pet is $5.19/bag. I'm using her indoor pen as my experiment, and did not put the WP as far as her door, but about a 12 x 12 area only. Normally that would take me 4-5 bags of shavings for a nice layer. That's (rounding off) 4-5 x $4 or $16-$20 to start out.

My problem is that within a week, those shavings are trampled, darkened, and it's impossible to see pee spots. Also very hard to see apples or pieces thereof if she breaks them up (which she can do fairly immediately before I get to it -- I clean her stall 2x/day.

Okay, I used 7 bags to start with of WP. That's (rounding off) $36 or so. HOWEVER, they are expanding to make a nice thick layer of finer stuff so that you can see wet spots and even broken up apples, and get them out without dragging shavings along (or alternatively spending a long time shaking them through the tines).

So it's most definitely more expensive starting out. They say it will be. But here's where the savings is claimed to come in: To start with, yes, you DO mix in the wet spots with the dry stuff, as they are used to expand the WP. However, once it's broken down (expanded) --and here's where a lot of people go wrong-- you STOP mixing in wet spots. You now want to remove them. However, instead of spreading out as they do with shavings (and taking a lot of unfouled or gratuitously fouled ADJACENT shavings along with them as a result of the spreading), the wet spots stay put. They are very easily identifiable. So you are removing JUST that part.

And now, when you are replenishing them (call it "Stage Two") as in "maintenance," you are adding substantially less additional WP, and you are mixing it in with the broken down material so that it will, as a result, also break down.

I have no clue how this will pan out over time, but I can tell you that so far (and it's only been about 4 days) the WP is processing beautifully. That means its original volume is expanding into a super nice consistency of bedding, and its volume has increased into a nice thick layer. And that layer, by its nature, is very easy to keep clean. A WHOLE lot cleaner than my shavings would have been in this same period of time.

Though it's not the same as there isn't the "cement" added, I'm equating it, in practice, to the difference between using "clumpable" cat litter vs. non-clump. With the Clump type, the cat piddles in a spot and that spot clumps together so you can easily remove it. What's left around the clumps you've removed is untouched, pristine cat litter.

In practice, the WP seems to operate similarly. When I replace some, I will NOT be adding volume-for-volume of new WP to what's been taken out, but instead, only 1/3rd the volume. So the smaller bags, and the "concentrated" material, even things out. The difference (important in my case) is that I'm not hauling big, bulky, heavy bags of shavings; but instead, "scoops"
of replenishing WP.

I did not understand at first how this stuff works (or is meant to work). But basically, there's a magical point where you go FROM mixing in to removal, and if you really read their instructions and follow them, you'll end up with MUCH less work, a much cleaner stall, easier maintenace and no urine smell. Again, the problems I've read people having have seemed to have arisen because they don't know when to stop mixing in the original "moisture." That's fine at first (and recommended) because that helps it expand, and it gets absorbed so there's no odor. But once you've done that initial step, you don't KEEP mixing in the urine spots, you quit.

I probably could have said all this in less words, but I'm learning as I go and for once I'm trusting in the packaged directions and going on blind faith that it works the way they say. Assuming it does, I'm definitely a convert. Clinton Anderson did a big demonstration on one of his segments (not WP but another brand that operates on the same premise) and he said right then and there that the company now sponsors him. HOWEVER, he said that he used the product for two years before that came about, and swore by it.

So we'll see. So far, I'm VERY impressed!!! It just stays cleaner and makes "things" very easy to identify. At least with my eyesight, lol. Actually it's pretty good. Duhhhh, I think.

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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  10:40:05 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Im dying reading your shavings costs! I spend $120/month...did I get that right ST, you said $120 for 6 months?????

No tractor supply here. $7/bag. Woody Pet same. Looks like I just get to pick which one I go broke on!!
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fracturedbones
Clinician



3424 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  10:40:05 AM  Show Profile  Visit fracturedbones's Homepage Send fracturedbones a Private Message
Im dying reading your shavings costs! I spend $120/month...did I get that right ST, you said $120 for 6 months?????

No tractor supply here. $7/bag. Woody Pet same. Looks like I just get to pick which one I go broke on!!
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  11:04:18 AM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
I get about 36 bags of shavings for around $120 including delivery to my barn. A bag will easily bed a 10 x 14 foot stall (That's the measurements for my stalls). Since my horses are out as much as weather will allow, this will last me darn near a year... maybe 9 months or so with 2 horses.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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Red Hawk
Clinician



USA
5092 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  11:04:18 AM  Show Profile Send Red Hawk a Private Message
I get about 36 bags of shavings for around $120 including delivery to my barn. A bag will easily bed a 10 x 14 foot stall (That's the measurements for my stalls). Since my horses are out as much as weather will allow, this will last me darn near a year... maybe 9 months or so with 2 horses.

"God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses"
--Robert Browning

Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow. Don't walk behind me, I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend.
-- Author Unknown
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Stormie
Clinician

1630 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  2:51:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit Stormie's Homepage Send Stormie a Private Message
I pay around $2 a bag for bedding. We have a place right here in town and sometimes they bring stuff to the shop to be fixed so sometimes I even get it for free. Right now the only stall I'm using is a 9.5x9.5 stall for the 7 month old bull. I put 2 bags in there to start but do the whole bank the new stuff to the sides so that where he goes is a little thinner. I pull that out move more from the sides into that area and then replace anywhere from 1/4 to 1/2 a bag a day. After a couple weeks or whenever it needs it I just slack off on replacing with new until the old is mostly gone and then strip it. I end up using very little bedding at all.

I use straw for foaling and normally work deals out through the shop for that too. I use in for the LG dogs also in their box. So far the cattle aren't eating it out of there so it should last alwhile for them. I tried the shavings when they where pups in the barn and it just tunred them into huge shaving balls. I still used them in their calf pens but I used the straw in their sections.

I would like to try to pellets and Peat Moss also as that is suppost to be good. I have no clue where to get the peat moss and no place close that really has the pellets.

On the DUH show a couple weeks ago he was mixing water with the pellets to puff them up faster and 'cleaner'. I think that is a better way to do it but since I haven't tried either way it might not be. I can see it puffing them up faster and you don't have the added urine mixed in, even if it doesn't smell it's there and the horse is laying on it and eating around it.
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Stormie
Clinician

1630 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  2:51:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit Stormie's Homepage Send Stormie a Private Message
I pay around $2 a bag for bedding. We have a place right here in town and sometimes they bring stuff to the shop to be fixed so sometimes I even get it for free. Right now the only stall I'm using is a 9.5x9.5 stall for the 7 month old bull. I put 2 bags in there to start but do the whole bank the new stuff to the sides so that where he goes is a little thinner. I pull that out move more from the sides into that area and then replace anywhere from 1/4 to 1/2 a bag a day. After a couple weeks or whenever it needs it I just slack off on replacing with new until the old is mostly gone and then strip it. I end up using very little bedding at all.

I use straw for foaling and normally work deals out through the shop for that too. I use in for the LG dogs also in their box. So far the cattle aren't eating it out of there so it should last alwhile for them. I tried the shavings when they where pups in the barn and it just tunred them into huge shaving balls. I still used them in their calf pens but I used the straw in their sections.

I would like to try to pellets and Peat Moss also as that is suppost to be good. I have no clue where to get the peat moss and no place close that really has the pellets.

On the DUH show a couple weeks ago he was mixing water with the pellets to puff them up faster and 'cleaner'. I think that is a better way to do it but since I haven't tried either way it might not be. I can see it puffing them up faster and you don't have the added urine mixed in, even if it doesn't smell it's there and the horse is laying on it and eating around it.
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hmeyer
Clinician



USA
2194 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  3:21:32 PM  Show Profile Send hmeyer a Private Message
Last winter, we used sawdust from a local mulch company (they said no walnut) for 11.50/cubic yard. We can get Woody Pet for about 4.50/bag. Not sure how many bags it takes to make a yard, though, especially after it has expanded. I'm pretty sure the sawdust is cheaper, however, I like the Woody Pet. I'm thinking about using a combination of about half & half. One thing is, the sawdust is somewhat damp and I think maybe the Woody Pet could help dry it out a little. What about that?

"You learn a thing a day, you store up smart" - Festus Haggen

"A manís soul canít be hidden,
From the creatures in his care." -
Hard Candy Cowboy by Debra Meyer



Edited by - hmeyer on 11/30/2005 3:22:38 PM
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hmeyer
Clinician



USA
2194 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  3:21:32 PM  Show Profile Send hmeyer a Private Message
Last winter, we used sawdust from a local mulch company (they said no walnut) for 11.50/cubic yard. We can get Woody Pet for about 4.50/bag. Not sure how many bags it takes to make a yard, though, especially after it has expanded. I'm pretty sure the sawdust is cheaper, however, I like the Woody Pet. I'm thinking about using a combination of about half & half. One thing is, the sawdust is somewhat damp and I think maybe the Woody Pet could help dry it out a little. What about that?

"You learn a thing a day, you store up smart" - Festus Haggen

"A manís soul canít be hidden,
From the creatures in his care." -
Hard Candy Cowboy by Debra Meyer



Edited by - hmeyer on 11/30/2005 3:22:38 PM
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Saddletramp
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
2546 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  4:48:26 PM  Show Profile  Visit Saddletramp's Homepage Send Saddletramp a Private Message
Yes, Fractured...$120 for 6 months....and actually, this load has stretched to almost 8 months, or it was a more tightly compressed load, more likely, as I'm with a new supplier, he probably really wanted to make sure that he started out on a good note.

Had a boarder who used WP, so I DID get to kinda do an experiment. My stalls are 14x16 or 14x18 and it took alot of WP to get him started. (OTW...7 BAGS to start!!!?? Nope, I can't justify that. My load of shavings is almost less labor-intensive too...it gets dumped in my shavings bin and I don't have to touch it till I dump it in the stalls. With WP, I'd be lugging bags, or paying for delivery. I just don't see the cost-effectiveness....no matter how I spin the numbers. And I'm thinking that I'm pretty much the norm cuz none of the larger barns in this area use WP...nor my trainer, not my farrier, or my vet, nor the equine school that I am familiar with.

As cool as it sounds, the numbers just don't shake out for me.

-Saddletramp

"She never moved the stars from their courses,
but she loved a good man and she rode good horses"
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Saddletramp
Trail Boss (Moderator)



USA
2546 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  4:48:26 PM  Show Profile  Visit Saddletramp's Homepage Send Saddletramp a Private Message
Yes, Fractured...$120 for 6 months....and actually, this load has stretched to almost 8 months, or it was a more tightly compressed load, more likely, as I'm with a new supplier, he probably really wanted to make sure that he started out on a good note.

Had a boarder who used WP, so I DID get to kinda do an experiment. My stalls are 14x16 or 14x18 and it took alot of WP to get him started. (OTW...7 BAGS to start!!!?? Nope, I can't justify that. My load of shavings is almost less labor-intensive too...it gets dumped in my shavings bin and I don't have to touch it till I dump it in the stalls. With WP, I'd be lugging bags, or paying for delivery. I just don't see the cost-effectiveness....no matter how I spin the numbers. And I'm thinking that I'm pretty much the norm cuz none of the larger barns in this area use WP...nor my trainer, not my farrier, or my vet, nor the equine school that I am familiar with.

As cool as it sounds, the numbers just don't shake out for me.

-Saddletramp

"She never moved the stars from their courses,
but she loved a good man and she rode good horses"
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  6:56:55 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by fracturedbones

Im dying reading your shavings costs! I spend $120/month...did I get that right ST, you said $120 for 6 months?????

No tractor supply here. $7/bag. Woody Pet same. Looks like I just get to pick which one I go broke on!!



I just choked on my coffee. FracturedBones, where do you live, New York City? I thought WE were expensive! Seven ($7) Dollars a bag? For shavings AND for WP???
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  6:56:55 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by fracturedbones

Im dying reading your shavings costs! I spend $120/month...did I get that right ST, you said $120 for 6 months?????

No tractor supply here. $7/bag. Woody Pet same. Looks like I just get to pick which one I go broke on!!



I just choked on my coffee. FracturedBones, where do you live, New York City? I thought WE were expensive! Seven ($7) Dollars a bag? For shavings AND for WP???
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:03:11 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Red Hawk

I get about 36 bags of shavings for around $120 including delivery to my barn. A bag will easily bed a 10 x 14 foot stall (That's the measurements for my stalls). Since my horses are out as much as weather will allow, this will last me darn near a year... maybe 9 months or so with 2 horses.



I'm having a heart attack reading both ends of this spectrum. RH, what size bags are these where one will easily bed a 10x14 ft. stall? That's 140 sq. ft. Bedding my 11 x 11 stall and 12 x 19 indoor pen, I've gone through 9 bags of shavings in about a month. The stall (which she doesn't use that much) is still "okay" but the indoor pen was toast and getting bad. That's where I went to the Woody Pet for.

Sheeeesh!
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:03:11 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Red Hawk

I get about 36 bags of shavings for around $120 including delivery to my barn. A bag will easily bed a 10 x 14 foot stall (That's the measurements for my stalls). Since my horses are out as much as weather will allow, this will last me darn near a year... maybe 9 months or so with 2 horses.



I'm having a heart attack reading both ends of this spectrum. RH, what size bags are these where one will easily bed a 10x14 ft. stall? That's 140 sq. ft. Bedding my 11 x 11 stall and 12 x 19 indoor pen, I've gone through 9 bags of shavings in about a month. The stall (which she doesn't use that much) is still "okay" but the indoor pen was toast and getting bad. That's where I went to the Woody Pet for.

Sheeeesh!
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:20:16 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Saddletramp

Yes, Fractured...$120 for 6 months....and actually, this load has stretched to almost 8 months, or it was a more tightly compressed load, more likely, as I'm with a new supplier, he probably really wanted to make sure that he started out on a good note.

Had a boarder who used WP, so I DID get to kinda do an experiment. My stalls are 14x16 or 14x18 and it took alot of WP to get him started. (OTW...7 BAGS to start!!!?? Nope, I can't justify that. My load of shavings is almost less labor-intensive too...it gets dumped in my shavings bin and I don't have to touch it till I dump it in the stalls. With WP, I'd be lugging bags, or paying for delivery. I just don't see the cost-effectiveness....no matter how I spin the numbers. And I'm thinking that I'm pretty much the norm cuz none of the larger barns in this area use WP...nor my trainer, not my farrier, or my vet, nor the equine school that I am familiar with.

As cool as it sounds, the numbers just don't shake out for me.



ST, they wouldn't shake out for you given the prices you get shavings for (or sawdust which I'm starting to think is preferable to shavings). Yup, I used 7 bags all right. I just couldn't fathom how thin a layer that made OR that it would "explode" into such a thick one once it got moisture and broke down and expanded. (Heck, I'd sleep in it, LOL. It's lush!) Okay, maybe I started with 8. I bought 9 and think I only have one left for supplementing, but hoping I have two. It was 7 or 8 bags, so I'm seeing a pretty thick layer of "stuff." I'll know better next time.

Meanwhile, I agree with Stormie about using water instead of urine to expand it. They SAY the urine is okay (I think it probably is based on the premise of the product) but Cloud hasn't accommodated me with much in her indoor pen since I put in the WP. I think she saves it for the outside or her shavings which are still in the stall). But our rains have been such that the moisture in the air, Cloud tracking in wet from outside and a few leaks here and there have done their thing to it. So just after 3-4 days I think it's broken down (and I LIKE the consistency!) so I'm now going into the phase where I'm not going to be mixing moisture into it anymore, but removing wet spots outright, and replenishing where they were with new WP so the cycle starts of blending and maintaining.

I really LOVE the consistency of it! Dang, it's so easy to isolate the "apples" and the wet spots! I hope this continues because I do think it'll be cheaper than my alternatives and I can tell you this much, I have a whole lot less in the wheelbarrow to deal with. It's pretty pure poop with very little in the way of bedding. And it seems to pick up really well.

Hey, FB, if you board for income, then you could get a big ole truck and make a trip to the city, live it up and deduct a lot of your expenses, just to make a haul on a less expensive product than what you're paying where you are. Ahhh, but I'll sure bet your tradeoff is a lovely rural setting, a "real" one!
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:20:16 PM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Saddletramp

Yes, Fractured...$120 for 6 months....and actually, this load has stretched to almost 8 months, or it was a more tightly compressed load, more likely, as I'm with a new supplier, he probably really wanted to make sure that he started out on a good note.

Had a boarder who used WP, so I DID get to kinda do an experiment. My stalls are 14x16 or 14x18 and it took alot of WP to get him started. (OTW...7 BAGS to start!!!?? Nope, I can't justify that. My load of shavings is almost less labor-intensive too...it gets dumped in my shavings bin and I don't have to touch it till I dump it in the stalls. With WP, I'd be lugging bags, or paying for delivery. I just don't see the cost-effectiveness....no matter how I spin the numbers. And I'm thinking that I'm pretty much the norm cuz none of the larger barns in this area use WP...nor my trainer, not my farrier, or my vet, nor the equine school that I am familiar with.

As cool as it sounds, the numbers just don't shake out for me.



ST, they wouldn't shake out for you given the prices you get shavings for (or sawdust which I'm starting to think is preferable to shavings). Yup, I used 7 bags all right. I just couldn't fathom how thin a layer that made OR that it would "explode" into such a thick one once it got moisture and broke down and expanded. (Heck, I'd sleep in it, LOL. It's lush!) Okay, maybe I started with 8. I bought 9 and think I only have one left for supplementing, but hoping I have two. It was 7 or 8 bags, so I'm seeing a pretty thick layer of "stuff." I'll know better next time.

Meanwhile, I agree with Stormie about using water instead of urine to expand it. They SAY the urine is okay (I think it probably is based on the premise of the product) but Cloud hasn't accommodated me with much in her indoor pen since I put in the WP. I think she saves it for the outside or her shavings which are still in the stall). But our rains have been such that the moisture in the air, Cloud tracking in wet from outside and a few leaks here and there have done their thing to it. So just after 3-4 days I think it's broken down (and I LIKE the consistency!) so I'm now going into the phase where I'm not going to be mixing moisture into it anymore, but removing wet spots outright, and replenishing where they were with new WP so the cycle starts of blending and maintaining.

I really LOVE the consistency of it! Dang, it's so easy to isolate the "apples" and the wet spots! I hope this continues because I do think it'll be cheaper than my alternatives and I can tell you this much, I have a whole lot less in the wheelbarrow to deal with. It's pretty pure poop with very little in the way of bedding. And it seems to pick up really well.

Hey, FB, if you board for income, then you could get a big ole truck and make a trip to the city, live it up and deduct a lot of your expenses, just to make a haul on a less expensive product than what you're paying where you are. Ahhh, but I'll sure bet your tradeoff is a lovely rural setting, a "real" one!
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EZ2SPOT
Clinician

USA
3785 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:48:29 PM  Show Profile  Visit EZ2SPOT's Homepage Send EZ2SPOT a Private Message
I used Woody Pet for years, but recently changed to a similiar product sold by my local feed store. It works the same and is a little cheaper.

Guess if I had access to cheap wood shavings as Saddletramp does, I would go with that. But I don't, and using the bagged shavings available here costs about the same as the wood pellet bedding...but the pelleted bedding is so much easier to use and makes stall cleaning go so much faster!

Everyone's situation is different, and anyone would have to be crazy not to take advantage of being able to get a terrific bargain on wood shavings. For those of us not so lucky, the pelleted beddings are an excellent option.

EZ2SPOT
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EZ2SPOT
Clinician

USA
3785 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2005 :  7:48:29 PM  Show Profile  Visit EZ2SPOT's Homepage Send EZ2SPOT a Private Message
I used Woody Pet for years, but recently changed to a similiar product sold by my local feed store. It works the same and is a little cheaper.

Guess if I had access to cheap wood shavings as Saddletramp does, I would go with that. But I don't, and using the bagged shavings available here costs about the same as the wood pellet bedding...but the pelleted bedding is so much easier to use and makes stall cleaning go so much faster!

Everyone's situation is different, and anyone would have to be crazy not to take advantage of being able to get a terrific bargain on wood shavings. For those of us not so lucky, the pelleted beddings are an excellent option.

EZ2SPOT
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OnTheWay
Clinician

1433 Posts

Posted - 12/01/2005 :  06:57:17 AM  Show Profile Send OnTheWay a Private Message
EZ, I agree. It hasn't been long enough for me to have a great tap on it yet, but everything I see about it, I prefer over shavings BIIIIIGGGG TIME!!!!

HM, your post got lost under the enthusiasm and/or shock of costs. Here's what the grain store guy told me (he has always had horses, currently TBs he's retired, but prior, a fair number of race horses). However, he's a "shavings man" and has very specific ideas about everything so here's what he said and then we have to decide whether he's right or just stubborn.

He said Woody Pet *OR* shavings, not to mix them. Now I have no idea why, but I have a feeling that if your sawdust is moist, you could mix them in with the WP when you put the WP down. On the other hand, if you WP is already into what I call "Stage Two," meaning that they are already broken down from the benefit of having moisture added in ORDER to break them down, that's when you want to stop adding moisture.

The WP, once broken down, I believe, is quite similar to sawdust in some ways. Except the way I remember sawdust, I recall it being a lot finer. Broken down WP has some body to it which is what I like about it. Also not the dust factor that I imagine sawdust would have.

In order to use or try WP, I'd sure see nothing wrong with mixing it with damp sawdust, because voila, there's the moisture it needs. It would definitely suck the moisture out of the sawdust, it's initially like a sponge from how I understand it. But then once it's done, I wouldn't add more damp sawdust to it.

As for volume (a key part of your post) -- I THINK that WP triples in volume, from pellet stage to final expanded stage. The reason is that the bag says that after it's volumized and you now REMOVE wet spots instead of mixing them in, to replace what you've taken out with one third the volume of new WP.

Hope that helps. I have a feeling this stuff is pretty amazing IF it is handled right. And despite its cost, I have a feeling it's going to last a whole lot longer so the relative cost diminishes quite a bit. But over and above that, as EZ says, it sure makes stall mucking a whole lot easier. Like... a TON easier!!! And in my case (and I imagine others as well) a biggie at any time (let alone in snow conditions blocking my manure pile access) -- the lessened volume that gets thrown out is going to be worth its weight in gold.

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